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#1
10-08-2009
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Posting Of Pay Site Images - All Read.
Please don't post more than 3 photos from any one set of a the below sites here. As producers, we work very hard and spend a lot of money to produce the content we do and as a fan myself, I certainly understand why you want to show off the content and share it. However, this is detrimental not only to our companies, but to the models, the fans and ultimately the production of TS porn in general as well as the welfare of this site and opening the possibility of the site and yourself, to legal action - something we'd not want to do, hence the requests here.
We allow forums and fans to use a small amount of content as it helps forums like this generate members and in turn, sell our sites which keeps them active and alive as they make money from each sale, which covers the servers and expenses. However, when you post massive amounts, people don't need to join a site and therefore everybody loses money - and the productions WILL stop or slow down ... then what will we all be jerking off to? Independent producers like Grooby, or Bobs-Tgirls, Krissy4u, DeliaTS, HotWendyWilliams work on small budgets that rely on membership levels to allow us to continue to produce and remain profitable and a massive amount of our budgets go directly back into models fees. So, I'd like to ask you all to please, refrain from posting links to tube sites showing stolen content, uploaded content, showing more than 3 photos from any one set from a website (and multiple users showing 3 photos each would be a breach of that rule) and to respect our property rights. If you want to see more content, then please go to a site whose product you like, take a look at their tours and their membership options, and join. Thank you. seanchai CLARIFICATION ADDED 09 OCT - IF YOU WISH TO POST THE IMAGES FROM CONTENT SPECIFICALLY GIVEN BY THE SITES FOR MARKETING, THEN THAT IS FINE. THIS SHOULD FIT INTO THE 15 IMAGES PER SET, DEEMED AS FAIR BY THE FORUM OWNERS. THIS DOES NOT MEAN YOU CAN TAKE ANY 15 IMAGES FROM THE MEMBERS SITE OR OTHER FREE/STOLEN CONTENT SITES for http://www.shemaleyum.com http://www.black-tgirls.com http://www.shemale-pornstar.com http://www.brazilian-transsexuals.com http://www.franks-tgirlworld.com http://www.bobs-tgirls.com http://www.shemales-from-hell.com http://www.shemalepornstar.com http://www.transexdomination.com http://www.zoefuckpupper.com http://www.straponjane.com http://www.deliats.com http://www.kimsanalheaven.com http://www.clubcrossdresser.com http://www.lucimay.com http://www.karentvslut.com http://www.candilovedoll.com http://www.nylonbitchyvette.com http://www.kirstystgplayground.com http://www.latinatranny.com http://www.shemale-club.com http://www.kimberjames.com http://www.kellyshore.com http://www.mariammicol.com http://www.tsfoxxy.com http://www.tsjesse.com http://www.hotwendywilliams.com http://www.interracialtgirlsex.com http://www.privatetranssexual.com http://www.jasminejewels.com http://www.mandymitchell.com http://www.natassiadreams.com http://www.hazeltucker.com |
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#2
10-08-2009
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Hi, I can appreciate your self interest here. I would like you to clarify something for all of us. Pretty much all of these picture do come from pay sites as the originating source. I, for one, have never contributed a single penny to a paysite directly. I may have some pics that did come from one directly through the sharing on this forum and others, but primarily the vast bulk of my files are from "gratis" sites. Are you asserting that we should not post more than 3 pics from a shoot when there is a free web page that shows up to twenty? In my mind, I see those pictures as paid for since we have to endure the advertising, pop ups, and other miscellania that accompany them.
Final Question  Do you consider the pics from the "free" sites as falling under your request?
__________________
Ask Jenae anything, just click on this link: http://forum.transladyboy.com/showthread.php?t=6056 |
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#3
10-08-2009
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Quote:
If it was from legal content released by the producers ie; FHG sites, then view than there and please don't repose more than 3 shots from any one set, here. Thanks hope this clarifies for you. Maybe you'd want to consider contributing a few pennies to a website directly? |
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#4
10-08-2009
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I am a bit affronted by your tone. You use the word "grabbed" instead of "downloaded" which implies I took them like some kind of thief. No I did not grab them; I downloaded pics that were freely offered. There are hundreds of web sites out there with links to gallery pages. Once you go to these pages, you are then free in most cases to download the pics there. Kinda like a free samples page from the producer who is hoping you will go their pay site and join. To this end, there is advertising and a link provided.
Example - I go to one of my favorites: http://www.maxshemales.com/main.shtml. There I find numerous links to other free hosting gallery pages along with many pages of samples. I pick out one I wish to look at and go there; in this case it is http://galleries.hotwendywilliams.com/gallery/t=british/s=47lisa/i=1834419 which is one of yours. Since she is acceptable, I download the pics. And I am done there. Nowhere do I see a claim of copyright which forbids the further dissemination of the pics. The closest thing is that each pic has a small logo on it which says Hot Wendy Productions on it. Now are you trying to tell me that none of your income is derived from the benefits of this process. Are you saying that you don't have new paying members join as a result of these free pics? Of course not. Whether I join or not is irrelevant, many do. And we will not even get into the subject of cookies, trojans, malware, etc that are foisted onto site visitors without their knowledge. Not saying your sites do this, but many sites do. As you well know, this forum has a rule limiting the number of pics and asks members to identify the site they came from. That is sufficient. And fair. For you to come on here and plead for a lower limit is ridiculous. I say if you don't like, it then limit your distributed free pics to 3 per shoot. That would be a surefire way to ensure your aim here. I seriously doubt you are willing to do this in the competative market you are in. I also doubt whether the amount of sharing here affects your business all that much, in fact I would guess it is microscopic in figures. Final words: "I think you are barking up the wrong tree" and "Why buy the cow when you are happy with the free milk." P.S. While I was composing this, I see other posts have been made. I will agree with you that the posting of material by members who have joined your sites and then proceed to post what I assume is copywrited and restricted material is ethically wrong. I would also agree that you have the right to try and stop these actions. I suggest you concentrate you efforts at your own sites. Perhaps you could encode information in the digital information of each pic that would allow you to identify the culprits; or would that be too cost prohibitive?
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Ask Jenae anything, just click on this link: http://forum.transladyboy.com/showthread.php?t=6056 Last edited by Jenae LaTorque; 10-08-2009 at 07:48 PM. |
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#5
10-08-2009
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Jenae
Whether you like my tone or not is irrelevant. Let me explain to you as your obviously unaware of intellectual copyright law so you may better understand it and won't have to appear so ignorant in arguing against it. The sample you gave: http://galleries.hotwendywilliams.co...lisa/i=1834419 All those photos belong to Wendy Williams. She has produced these galleries for her affiliates to make sales to her sites. Nobody has permission to steal those images, from her server and post them elsewhere. It's theft and any host that puts those images up, can be punishable by law. Most companies affiliate programs have strict Terms and Conditions on the usage of material. This content is NOT free. You can watch an advertisement on TV which based on your argument is "free" but you cannot take the content of that advertisement and use it to your own purposes. There does not have to be a copyright statement on a page. Wendy holds the intellectual copyright to that content. I don't care what YOU think is sufficient and fair. I'm asking for people to respect producers copyright, including our own and show a fair amount of images. YOU are technically breaking the law if you upload content that doesn't belong to you. I respect your opinions if you don't think this would make a difference to our business but I've been very successful in this business for over 12 years and in my opinion, it does make a difference and that's what I'm asking for the help of the board. More aggressive companies or companies who aren't part of the tgirl culture may simply DMCA the owners of this board and demand that all content must be removed - and the owners, legally, would be forced to oblige. If you don't like that, then just don't post anything. |
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#6
10-08-2009
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I think the 3 pic rule is reasonable. If you like a certain girl and want to post pics to help promote her then just do three from one set then three from another to show variety. The more exposure she gets then the more fans and members will join pay sites. Just use the rule of three.
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#7
10-09-2009
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"We learn as we go"
The quote is from the character "Frenchy" in The Cotton Club movie.
So I did some research on copyrights, and I believe I now have a better grasp of the situation. Technically you are pretty much right, concerning the issue of copyright infringement, but I still think you are "barking up the wrong tree." There are still a lot of "grey" areas in the matter of copyright infringement over the internet. You have several problems with your case: 1. Your Subject Matter - Your area is pornography, and to make matters worse, it is transgender porn which is even more repugnant to a large segment of the public. True, this should not matter in terms of the application of the law, but you know, as we all do, that justice is oftentimes not served when it comes to T-people. I don't expect that you will find a lot of sympathy out there for your plight. You will find more here as long as you are civil. 2. Proving Your Case - I can see where you may have a hard time proving damages here when you already have a multitude of porn images elsewhere availible on the internet for down loading free of charge. When it comes down to the numbers, the number of downloads here will be dwarved by the daily number of downloads at the original page. You will also need to prove that a significant number would have joined your site if they were unable to download the pics here. As part of researching this subject I had to check out the Harley thread since I am not a fan of hers. And, I found that there are not really that many pics there. I am going to assume that there were a lot of them since you are bitchin' about it. That leads me to the conclusion that you have already coerced the site authorities into removing a great many of the disputed pics. If you did this solely on your own as a moderator, I suggest that there may be a "conflict of interest here." This would be further evidenced by the fact that I am aware of several threads where there are sets represented by many more pics than the 15 pic limit, and they have not been pruned or removed entirely. 3. The Question of Who is Liable - You suggested or threatened that you could hold us, the members of the forum, responsible for the copyright infringement. You know, or your lawyers should know, that this would be a very difficult road to follow since we are not the owners of the site. Now there are a whole lot of legal issues concerning that..... so, I won't go into that since you have lawyers for that. Suffice it to say, that most forum members have stayed within the requirements of the forum rules. You may have a case against members who posted pictures that they obtained as a member of your sites, but I think your case against those of us who simply posted pictures that are freely available is very weak at best, almost nil in fact. :D Now I have a question here. By posting on here, did you solicit our opinions, and are you thus obligated to compensate me for my advice if you use it in any way to form your legal position. If you feel so, I would accept a free membership to the SM Club site
__________________
Ask Jenae anything, just click on this link: http://forum.transladyboy.com/showthread.php?t=6056 |
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#8
10-08-2009
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re max 3 photos
Quote:
I fully understand your point but I personally thought we were actually promoting your sites by posting the promo pics. This forum has a rule that forbids members to post full 'sets' of models or video clips over 9 mins. This is to ensure that the 'copyrights' of the pics etc you are speaking of, are not violated. Also members are asked to mention the site to promote the producer. I personally respect that and I do know that the cost of running such websites are astronomical because Ive often exchanged mails with the site owners that I have been a member of. But my question is: Are you saying that we should only post 3 pics that are shown in the original site, even when there are sometimes 50 or more in the preview sections, because otherwise the members will lose interest to look the site up and take the tour? Im sure the majority of members do not wish to infringe on your property rights and will take your request into consideration. By the way, thanks for that list of sites you posted and of course, your efforts regarding the Grooby sites. Regards Lba |
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#9
10-08-2009
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Hi Lba
All we're asking is for 3 images from each set not each site. Not even each model! I don't know many companies which show more than this small amount in a tour. Whilst the forum might ask members to abide by rules, quite simply, not everyone has the same respect as you. The Linetrap/Harley Quinn post has had full sets of ours posted and links to the whole video on *******.com Another poster has posted about 40 images from the same set of Chrissy. We work diligently on our own promotions and we like and respect forums like this, which is why the websites do allow so much of their content to be used but ultimately showing too much is hurting producers too much. Regards Steven |
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#10
10-10-2009
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Quote:
http://web.newsguy.com/ReaLi5TiX/home.htm http://www.tslist.com/list.html Thanks and kisses, Gabby 
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#11
10-11-2009
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hmm
As a Producer myself I have to agree with Seanchai about posting "excessive" amounts of pictures from a set. I DO NOT have a problem with a fan posting some pictures to reply to a thread about something like "favorite shemale" "girls in glasses" ETC ETC HOWEVER I do NOT want someone posting excessive amounts from a set because I only usually release 15 pictures from a set for my affiliates..........Fans using pictures on boards is different to someone who is an affiliate and is providing traffic for that reason to my website. Those affiliates are usually providing a text link to my website and I am going to hopefully get traffic from that whereas a FAN posting pictures is usually more for "sharing" than for promotion, THOUGH sometimes it goes hand in hand.
So I LOVE LOVE to see and read threads about myself and the ladies I shoot but I hope people can realize how much money I spend to run a website and hold back with excessive posting of pictures from myself or my models sets. Hugs Wendy NOW GET TO JACKING OFF LOL |
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#12
10-11-2009
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Wendy,
Thank you, Classy Lady. It is nice to hear from you on this matter. Your input was very well put, and I couldn't agree with you more. _____________________________  ___________________ ______________ seanchi, I would like to apologize for taking offense at your tone. I did do the google search you suggested. OOPS! I quickly saw part of our problem. It's that Scots-Irish heritage which we share. Not the most diplomatic people in the world are we? I am glad that this discussion did not get as hot as some board exchanges(wars?) I saw. I still have a problem seeing that the amount of traffic in pics here is a serious problem. I will say that there maybe was a problem with several threads though. Having an engineering background, I do notice numbers. And I had noticed the very high number of visits to the Harley thread. Since you have removed the majority of the pics, I was unable to assertain how many downloads there have been. Of the pics remaining, the high number was 353, with the majority falling under 100 views(downloads). The high count downloaded pic suggests that maybe it was just the tip of an iceberg and that many of the removed pics had a higher download number. It is still debatable how many of those "grabs" resulted in lost sales for you. There are some other threads that do have relatively high download counts, but in general, most pics here do not. A lot of this is due to the way download restrictions are. There are less than 180 members who have posts of over 100 and I suspect many of them, like me, don't download many pics here. Then there are the numbers of who is here on the home page. At the present moment as I write this, there are 19 members and 59 guests here. Since guests are unable to download pics; their presence, while contributing to the count for thread visits, do not count any for downloaded pics. All they can do here is read the posts, save small pics, and follow links posted here. I can readily see where links to sites that do post massive amounts of "stolen material" is a matter of deep concern to producers, not only in your field, but in all areas. I don't envy you - your problems there. Summation - I don't see pic posting here as a big problem for you. As has been stated, they are also a promotion for your sites, not as good as your promo galleries, but a promotion nevertheless. There may need to be a modification of the rules here regarding posting. As it is, sometimes you have one member posting pics from a set, and then another member posts more pics from the same set, and then another.... Not good! Perhaps we need a modification in the rules regarding this. Perhaps the mods and the big boss could come up with something there. I wish you the best of luck in your fight and like I said before - I don't envy you your problems. And I certainly don't envy your position as moderator - you can ask SSL about that.
__________________
Ask Jenae anything, just click on this link: http://forum.transladyboy.com/showthread.php?t=6056 |
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#13
10-11-2009
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Jenae
After only just returning home after many years living abroad and even more years on the internet, I know it's a thin line in text compared to a much broader one verbally. Respectfully, you can quote numbers to me all night ... if this forum had 5 members posting multiple sets, we'd still have a problem. This is not the only TG forum we work with, practically every decent forum out there we've had an agreement with and it's nothing new with this forum. Only when I returned from being away from the trip, did I notice to the extent some threads had gotten out of hand (incl. one posted today - see above). If I hadn't made a notification, 95% of people probably wouldn't have realised we were asking for content to be deleted. However, given the fact that I will be watching more actively what's going up, in an effort to save my time and to be transparant, I made the requests. Quote:
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#14
10-12-2009
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Quote:
The request was made for people to exhibit some respect and self-control and limit posting pictures to 3 pictures from one set. This you answer by compiling data and statistics with the effort to show that there are few potential members here on this Forum and stating that it's all in the name of advertising? Irrelevant to the original request. Who cares about your data and statistics which, to me, only show the narcissistic tendencies you seem to exhibit on a regular basis? The original point was, posting of content is getting out of hand and in a fair attempt at compromise and avoiding further action, 3 pictures was put forth as a limit. How does the potential member base here or the efficacy of advertising have any relevancy to the original topic? You hurl unfounded insults to someone and then offer a backhanded apology (if you can call it that) and then further try to confuse the original issue? Seriously, folks, I'm all for lively debate and will gladly take the time to explain my points of view. But let's not muddle the waters with insults and irrelevant points. I have yet to see someone respond logically to the points I have offered here without digressing into a 3rd grade, 'Well you're stupid' mentality (with the one possible exception of Be_my_nude).
__________________
Kisses, Krissy | Hazel Tucker Blog | Kimber James Blog | Krissy4u - The Blog | Natalia Coxxx Blog |
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#15
10-12-2009
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ask: in the news-groups are galleries with more than 15. how it behaves there
with Seanchai's postulates, because there you no restrictions. who offers a fair, you need not fear for his client. friendly greetings |
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#16
10-12-2009
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Quote:
Newsgroups are a whole other ballgame and cannot be compared to Forums with moderation. Obviously, they are pretty difficult to police and hey, if you want to download stuff from there with the risk of trojans and viruses... more power to you.
__________________
Kisses, Krissy | Hazel Tucker Blog | Kimber James Blog | Krissy4u - The Blog | Natalia Coxxx Blog |
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#17
10-12-2009
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Quote:
The news-group server thwarting the requirement of the industry to limitation. copyright as defined in the internet unclear. Seanchai says what is clear. who wants to keep customers, it must treat them fairly. Otherwise they are looking for other opportunities. friendly greetings |
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#18
10-12-2009
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Quote:
Hey, I'm all for competition between businesses. I don't think you're quite being clear as to what you're saying 'treat them fairly' is all about. If you're stating that a particular company does not treat their members fairly, you should be able to back that statement up with facts though. If anyone is being treated unfairly, it is the sites who deliver the content to paying members and then have to deal with dishonest members who redistribute content illegally. Copyright as defined in the Internet is NOT unclear. I don't know where this whole feeling comes from. Let's be clear... the Internet is just a big, fat, bloated library. Libraries are full of intellectual property that is (at least when I was a kid, it was... I haven't actually been to a physical library in some time) FREE. That doesn't mean that all the property contained in it is magically public domain. Just because something is ACCESSIBLE doesn't mean it's not owned by somebody. That's why most companies trademark their images... Anyway... again... completely irrelevant to the topic at hand.
__________________
Kisses, Krissy | Hazel Tucker Blog | Kimber James Blog | Krissy4u - The Blog | Natalia Coxxx Blog Last edited by GroobyKrissy; 10-12-2009 at 01:12 PM. |
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#19
10-12-2009
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Quote:
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#21
10-12-2009
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Master Citoyen??
__________________
Ask Jenae anything, just click on this link: http://forum.transladyboy.com/showthread.php?t=6056 |
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