Transexuals through history

[Florian]

Originally Posted by rjm1971

Not sure if it has been mentioned , as I am new here, but "Saraph" mention in Greek, Latin, Hebrew and even Christian literature (angel hierarchy) is said to have female angelic body features and both sets of genitals as well. Including breasts of course.

I'm no expert on angels, but always believed they were men only. Please tell me more!

[Elonar]

Originally Posted by Florian

I'm no expert on angels, but always believed they were men only. Please tell me more!

The Judaeo-Christian tradition rooted in that of the Hebrews invariably presented its authority as patriarchal. This probably explains why Jahweh, Jehovah, and God had to be referred to as ' He ', and the lesser spirit minions such as Cherubim, and Seraphs doing ' his ' bidding would carry divine masculine authority. Hence Michael, Raphael, Lucifer ( Satan ), Azrael etc would all be considered ' He-s ' . For female Divinities and spirits, you would have to look to the Babylonian tradition.

After all, in the Christian Tradition, the Virgin Mary conceived by divine intervention, and since Mary was female, however mystical you make it, the logical conclusion is that she was impregnated, and that the divine medium for that took on male powers to do that !

But when you are dealing with matters of pure faith and conjecture, even the impossible becomes possible.

Personally I prefer to view my Guardian Angel ( if indeed I have one ) as essentially female - so much more sympathetic and non-judgmental !

[sosed]

In early Hebrew kingdoms of Juda and Israel they worship both god Jahweh and goddess Astarte. But later also with pressure of Jahweh clerics and kings Hebrews abandon goddess Astarte and prohibit her worship. It was politics of that time, which create Jewish religion as it was.

[sosed]

I find interesting book about Gallae priestesses with headline The Gallae: transgender priests of ancient Greece, Rome and the Near East.

In ancient times societies never associate third gender, where they see eunuchs, castrates, trans persons, etc, as males. For them, they are neither male neither female, but usually their role is associated with females in contrast with today, where many people associate tgirls with males, because they still have penis.

[franalexes]

Originally Posted by Florian

I'm no expert on angels, but always believed they were men only. Please tell me more!

In our human minds, inferior as they are, we have created perhaps this vision of male and female angels. But angels being of devine and heavenly creation have no need of sex and therefore is there any distinction of male or female?
We don't know what we don't know.

[Florian]

Thank God I'm not of heavenly creation!

Originally Posted by franalexes

In our human minds, inferior as they are, we have created perhaps this vision of male and female angels. But angels being of devine and heavenly creation have no need of sex and therefore is there any distinction of male or female?
We don't know what we don't know.

[smc]

I came across this wonderful take on ancient Greek pottery and thought it would be worth posting in this thread. (Kudos to the artist, Anasheya.)

[franalexes]

If that is from the Greek era, one wonders if TS existed then or if men had erotic dreams of being women.
Probably both.

[smc]

Originally Posted by franalexes

If that is from the Greek era, one wonders if TS existed then or if men had erotic dreams of being women.
Probably both.

Please note that I wrote it is a "take on ancient Greek pottery," not an actual example.

There were transsexuals in ancient Greece. Most notably, there were the gallae, priests of Kybele. You could look it up.

[Florian]

I tried "gallae" and got redirected to "galli", being the plural of "gaul", which is totally irrelevant. With Kybele I got redirected to Cybele. I always knew her as Cybele, but I think your use of K rather than C would be more accurate as the name came to us via the greeks.

Originally Posted by smc

Please note that I wrote it is a "take on ancient Greek pottery," not an actual example.

There were transsexuals in ancient Greece. Most notably, there were the gallae, priests of Kybele. You could look it up.