If police question/detain a black person is it racism?

[TracyCoxx]

Originally Posted by TheCrystalKing

On this subject, however, a very conservative and Republican friend of mine - whose father happens to be a police officer - had something interesting to say: allegedly, in our county, there were statistically more crimes perpetrated by black males than any other demographic, by a considerable margin. Therefore, my friend argued that his father wasn't being racist in taking the occassional conclusional jump against a potential criminal based on race - he was just listening to the statistics.

Those statistics are probably true, but I still don't think cops should assume a suspect is probably guilty just because he's black. At the same time, since those statistics say more black males commit crimes than any other demographic, they should not balk if they are caught doing something, or if a police questions them due to reasonable circumstances - like investigating a break-in. The fault is not with the officer who observes blacks committing more than their fair share of crimes as long as he's not using race alone to determine who's a suspect.

[The Conquistador]

Gates is a dumbass. He sounds like one of those schmucks from COPS who gets pulled over for speeding or something minor and then escalates the situation by being loud, uncooperative and obnoxious and then ends up getting a taser shoved in their ass. You can get arrested for verbal abuse and it sounds like that is what happened.

[TracyCoxx]

Chris Rock - How Not to get your Ass Kicked by the Police

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTBskrO9nV8

[lbfno]

[QUOTE=TracyCoxx;96117]Chris Rock - How Not to get your Ass Kicked by the Police


awesome

[violet lightning]

Well how does everyone feel now that the phone transcripts have been released and the "Beer Summit" has taken place?

The caller that phoned in the 911 call stated emphatically that
1.) she didn't know what color, race or age of the people involved, (when pressed, she said one might be Hispanic)
and
2.) She stated clearly that it was very possible that the people were the home owners since they had luggage.

I assume the police were aware of this possibility and it doesn't sound like they barged into his home bent on arresting him.

3.) Turns out that the policeman was an experienced officer and even taught classes on how not to racial profile.

A telling clip is the video taken after the beer summit, when Crowley is shown helping Gates walk as President Obama struts happily toward the cameras, oblivious to whats happening behind him.

As far as I'm concerned, there are good people and assholes. Thats the only differenciation I make. Optimistically, I think most people are good, care about others and just want to live their lives. (80-90 percent?) Hopefully, assholes only make up a small percentage of the population, but boy do they like to fuck things up for everyone.
(hey, I'm starting to sound like "Team America"!
The whole "Dicks fuck assholes" speech..)

[tslust]

Originally Posted by violet lightning

A telling clip is the video taken after the beer summit, when Crowley is shown helping Gates walk as President obama struts happily toward the cameras, oblivious to whats happening behind him.

Ya, I really loved that.

[Jenae LaTorque]

I see this case as one of where two people failed each other. They both made assumptions based on little evidence and failed to give each other the benifit of the doubt. The big problem with people in conflict is that they usually bring a lot of baggage to a meeting. I remember my Grandfather explaining how he felt one time after another driver yelled an obscenity at him on the back road to town. He said something to the effect that since he didn't know that man and that man didn't know him, it was just dust in the wind. He then explained that he could only really get mad at those he knew, and then on rare occasions. And that furthermore it had been his experiance that both sides getting mad only fanned the flames.
I did see him get mad a few times though. And boy could he do it. Once we both saw a man kick a dog for no reason other than it was in his way a bit. By the time Grandpa got done giving that fellow what for, the guy was totally embarassed and very shamefaced. I don't think I've ever heard anybody apologize so much in my life.

You know something. I would suppose for every case that we hear about like this, there are hundreds of cases where the matter is resolved in a courteous manner; at least I hope so.
As for the cop bashing going on here by some, all I can say is you usually only get what you pay for. If the money isn't allocated to attract the best men, and the money isn't allocated to train and counsel them in the proper performance of their duties, then what do you expect. The qualities that are desirable in a good police officer are not found in many men, in fact, I would say damn few. And often the best of what we do get, don't remain on the force. Most of the best police officers I ever knew have moved on to become lawyers, judges, county commisioners, not to mention those who move on to upper level police force management.

Students of history can tell you that we have, on the average, the finest police to ever walk this planet. Check your history books.

[violet lightning]

Once again, it all boils down to Common Sense, Rationality and the Golden Rule.
Cops can be abusive at times, I've been the victim and have seen what assholes some cops can be. (in my case, it was mistaken identity which was remedied, but not before being verbally accused and taken downtown in cuffs!) But some of those cops were OK too, so it again boils down to the individual. (not groups like "pigs", thats just as bad!)

So some police can be rascist just as in any job, and guess what some white people are rascist too, and you know what? Some black people are rascist as well!
Its a human trait to be found in all variations of man.
So using common sense, it does seem reasonable (a key word) that a home owner would show his ID to a policeman who was investigating a break-in at his own home. In effect, trying to protect Gates.

Gates was probably already pissed-off about getting locked-out and having to break in to his own home.
As for the person who called in the break-in, I don't know the full details. How much did the person see? The whole break in, or just someones ass sticking out a window and disappearing?
There may be a racial component to the call, but maybe not. If I saw someone breaking into a neighbors house, I honestly wouldn't care about what color they were, or age, or whatever. And I wouldn't go over to ask them what they were doing either. I'd call it in and let the cops deal with it.
(and by the way, that has got to be a reall hard job)

So we have all heard of the real cases of police abuse and I hate it-but I don't hate the police. I certainly don't bow down to them either, but I do try to show respect and cooperate if its warranted. (I think people have a love/hate relationship with police...they can infringe on our personal freedom at times, but boy when we need them, are we glad they are there!)

I feel like in this case , Gates over-reacted and felt singled-out and perhaps embarrassed. (as in "Don't you know who I am... ? )
It sounds like the cop took an earful for as long as he could, and was even outside leaving, as Gates continued to hurl insults at his mother. Now who is verbally abusing who? So the cop could have let it go, but he decided he had had enough and the professor had lots of chances to just let it go.
I think unwittingly, by saying he was a friend of the President, he has actually hurt his friends carreer by creating a mini-uproar.
Now he's being called to the White House for a meeting with Obama. I'd like to be a fly on the wall for that discussion.

What erks me is President Obama and the stupid Governor weighing in on the case before, as they even admitted , all the facts were in. Both assumed the police were wrong and both now sound like Mike Naiphong (sp?) the dumb ass prosecutor in the Duke University "rape" case.
Really dumb, rookie mistakes. Wait till the facts come in, especially in a case involving race issues. (which I wish were "non-issues")

Now racial profiling and statistics are an interesting topic too....

[TracyCoxx]

Originally Posted by violet lightning

What erks me is President Obama and the stupid Governor weighing in on the case before, as they even admitted , all the facts were in.

Yeah, while I agree that Crowley shouldn't have arrested Gates, I do love watching BO squirm. And it's all due to his own inexperience.

[jdawg]

If the cops showed up during an in-progress break-in I'm almost 100% positive that there wouldn't be any back and forth about rights as the suspects would run. So I can't even really answer that hypothetical as it would never occur.

[tslust]

Originally Posted by jdawg

If the cops showed up during an in-progress break-in I'm almost 100% positive that there wouldn't be any back and forth about rights as the suspects would run.

You'd be surprised at how many would-be robbers actually try to convince a cop that they're the owner.

[TracyCoxx]

Originally Posted by jdawg

If the cops showed up during an in-progress break-in I'm almost 100% positive that there wouldn't be any back and forth about rights as the suspects would run. So I can't even really answer that hypothetical as it would never occur.

When you make police impotent, it will occur. If cops aren't allowed to insult the suspect by insinuating they shouldn't be there, then they just have to act like they own the place. What's the cop going to do?

Originally Posted by jdawg

It should be noted that Gates did provide a Harvard ID. So for all of the people saying that he was an asshole who wouldn't provide identification. You're wrong.

No, he was an asshole who cried racist at a cop who was just doing his job. At least up until the point where he arrested Gates.