Thoughts on Today's Political Landscape

[tslust]

Originally Posted by smc

It's outrageous, and The Huffington Post is correct to state that Obama's has morphed into a third Bush term (on issues like this). But let's be honest about it: do you think that if Bush was about to sign legislation like this, the Fox News report would even be remotely similar?

Of course not. It would have been touted as crucial to fighting terrorism, sedition, or whatever. There would not have been a peep about civil liberties.

Very late into his second term (like almost the last thing he did) Bush did sign into law a bill that in effect made it illegal to criticize the sitting president.

[TracyCoxx]

I wonder how many of Obama's other skeletons in his closet took the pay-off?

?How much money did he offer you??

?One hundred and fifty thousand dollars,? Wright said.

?And one of the first things Barack said was, ?I really wish you wouldn?t do any more public speaking until after the November election.? He knew I had some speaking engagements lined up, and he said, ?I wish you wouldn?t speak. It?s gonna hurt the campaign if you do that.?

?Barack said, ?I?m sorry you don?t see it the way I do. Do you know what your problem is?? And I said, ?No, what?s my problem?? And he said, ?You have to tell the truth.? I said, ?That?s a good problem to have. That?s a good problem for all preachers to have. That?s why I could never be a politician.?

So Obama wasn't just a passive listener in church. Interesting to hear what Obama considers "the truth".

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/nationa...l3fUF0cb7LpcNM

[smc]

Originally Posted by TracyCoxx

I wonder how many of Obama's other skeletons in his closet took the pay-off?

So Obama wasn't just a passive listener in church. Interesting to hear what Obama considers "the truth".

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/nationa...l3fUF0cb7LpcNM

Oh, my god! A politician from one of the two parties of the ruling rich using money to silence someone who might derail their campaigns. I can't imagine any Republicans have ever done this.

Yes, if it's true, it's reprehensible. Reprehensible. But a surprise? No. Uncharacteristic of politics? No. Newsworthy? Maybe a bit.

[transjen]

So far all Romney and other GOP bozos have done is bitch and complain about Obama's handeling of the econmy and so far all they have done is preech and hold up there dusty failed econmic plan that lead us to the econmy tanking under GOP control and the rain of George W Bush
The failed trickle down policies of cutting taxs for the rich cutting captial gains tax and cutting taxs for the multi billion dollar bussiness's and shift all the tax burden on the 99 ppercenters
so far the econmy savior Romney has offered nothing new on how to fix things his announced plans to basicly pick up where W left off
doubling down on the failed policies that kead us in to the worst econmey since the great depression which was caused by the GOP by the way under president Hover and president Coolidge
Wake up America and smell the coffee
Romney is nothing but a bussiness CEO and spoiled rich brat which sounds like another failed president George W Bush
in US history we have so far had only two CEO's as president Hoover and W and both destory our econmy and yet the GOP is givings us another on who what to pick up where W left off and actually put us in to another great depression
Jerseygirl Jen

[franalexes]

The Difference


President George W. Bush's speech afterthe capture of Saddam Hussein:
"The success of yesterday's mission is a tribute to our men and women now serving in Iraq . The operation was based on the superb work of intelligence analysts who found the dictator's footprints in a vast country. The operation was carried out with skill and precision by a brave fighting force. Our servicemen and women and our coalition allies have faced many dangers in the hunt for members of the fallen regime, and in their effort to bring hope and freedom to the Iraqi people. Their work continues, and so do the risks. Today, on behalf of the nation, I thank the members of our Armed Forces and I congratulate them!"


Obama's speech after the killing of Osama bin Laden:
"And so shortly after taking office, I directed Leon Panetta, the Director of the CIA, to make the killing or capture of bin Laden the top priority of our war against al Qaeda, even as we continued our broader efforts to disrupt, dismantle, and defeat his network. Then, last August, I was briefed on a possible lead to bin Laden. It was far from certain, and it took many months to run this thread to ground. I met repeatedly with my national security team as we developed more information about the possibility that we had located bin Laden hiding within a compound deep inside of Pakistan . And finally, last week, I determined that we had enough intelligence to take action, and I authorized an operation to get Osama bin Laden and bring him to justice. Today, at my direction, the United States launched a targeted operation against that compound in Abbottabad , Pakistan ."



Obama did not once acknowledge our brave men and women who fight for our country....and that myfriends is THE DIFFERENCE !

[smc]

Originally Posted by franalexes

The Difference


President George W. Bush's speech afterthe capture of Saddam Hussein:
"The success of yesterday's mission is a tribute to our men and women now serving in Iraq . The operation was based on the superb work of intelligence analysts who found the dictator's footprints in a vast country. The operation was carried out with skill and precision by a brave fighting force. Our servicemen and women and our coalition allies have faced many dangers in the hunt for members of the fallen regime, and in their effort to bring hope and freedom to the Iraqi people. Their work continues, and so do the risks. Today, on behalf of the nation, I thank the members of our Armed Forces and I congratulate them!"


Obama's speech after the killing of Osama bin Laden:
"And so shortly after taking office, I directed Leon Panetta, the Director of the CIA, to make the killing or capture of bin Laden the top priority of our war against al Qaeda, even as we continued our broader efforts to disrupt, dismantle, and defeat his network. Then, last August, I was briefed on a possible lead to bin Laden. It was far from certain, and it took many months to run this thread to ground. I met repeatedly with my national security team as we developed more information about the possibility that we had located bin Laden hiding within a compound deep inside of Pakistan . And finally, last week, I determined that we had enough intelligence to take action, and I authorized an operation to get Osama bin Laden and bring him to justice. Today, at my direction, the United States launched a targeted operation against that compound in Abbottabad , Pakistan ."



Obama did not once acknowledge our brave men and women who fight for our country....and that myfriends is THE DIFFERENCE !

I am not an Obama supporter, but I am a supporter of truth. And I am afraid that the post by franalexes is not the truth.

The full transcript of Obama's speech announcing the death of bin Laden is readily available at the White House website and on many, many other sites (including news sites such as CNN.com). There, the untruth of franalexes' post can be found. Obama said in that speech:

"Tonight, we give thanks to the countless intelligence and counterterrorism professionals who've worked tirelessly to achieve this outcome. The American people do not see their work, nor know their names. But tonight, they feel the satisfaction of their work and the result of their pursuit of justice.

"We give thanks for the men who carried out this operation, for they exemplify the professionalism, patriotism, and unparalleled courage of those who serve our country. And they are part of a generation that has borne the heaviest share of the burden since that September day."

A post of the type above by franalexes is designed to perpetuate the myth the right so adroitly spins that Obama is somehow "different" or "other." Hell, she even uses the word "difference" to close her post. But the only difference here is that Obama, in this one speech, limited his direct thanks to those who carried out the mission in Afghanistan to get bin Laden. Bush, who sent American soldiers to lose their lives in Iraq based on a total lie, broadly thanked the members of the Armed Forces.

Just to set the record straight, Obama makes speeches thanking the Armed Forces for their service with regularity. Here are excerpts from just one example, at Fort Bragg on December 14, 2011, announcing the formal "end" of the war in Iraq:

"... the United States military is the most respected institution in our land because you never forget that. You can?t afford to forget it. If you forget it, somebody dies. If you forget it, a mission fails. So you don?t forget it. You have each other?s backs. That?s why you, the 9/11 Generation, has earned your place in history.

"Because of you -- because you sacrificed so much for a people that you had never met, Iraqis have a chance to forge their own destiny. That?s part of what makes us special as Americans. ...

"Because of you, in Afghanistan we?ve broken the momentum of the Taliban. Because of you, we?ve begun a transition to the Afghans that will allow us to bring our troops home from there. And around the globe, as we draw down in Iraq, we have gone after al Qaeda so that terrorists who threaten America will have no safe haven, and Osama bin Laden will never again walk the face of this Earth.

"So here?s what I want you to know, and here?s what I want all our men and women in uniform to know: Because of you, we are ending these wars in a way that will make America stronger and the world more secure. Because of you. ...

"The war in Iraq will soon belong to history. Your service belongs to the ages. Never forget that you are part of an unbroken line of heroes spanning two centuries ?- from the colonists who overthrew an empire, to your grandparents and parents who faced down fascism and communism, to you ?- men and women who fought for the same principles in Fallujah and Kandahar, and delivered justice to those who attacked us on 9/11. ...

"All of you here today have lived through the fires of war. You will be remembered for it. You will be honored for it -- always. You have done something profound with your lives. When this nation went to war, you signed up to serve. When times were tough, you kept fighting. When there was no end in sight, you found light in the darkness. ...

"And years from now, your legacy will endure in the names of your fallen comrades etched on headstones at Arlington, and the quiet memorials across our country; in the whispered words of admiration as you march in parades, and in the freedom of our children and our grandchildren. And in the quiet of night, you will recall that your heart was once touched by fire. You will know that you answered when your country called; you served a cause greater than yourselves; you helped forge a just and lasting peace with Iraq, and among all nations.

"I could not be prouder of you, and America could not be prouder of you."

The honest response from franalexes would be to come on and post a simple retraction of her attempt to divide people on such a flimsy basis. There are plenty of genuine policy differences among politicians that demand serious discussion. The attempt to perpetuate the pseudo-"otherness" of Barack Obama does a disservice to the cause of everything I bet franalexes would insist she stands for as an American.

[GRH]

There WAS a difference between the two speeches SMC. One of them dealt with a credible threat to our national security; the other, not so much. I don't think that was supposed to be what I took away from Fran's post though.

[TracyCoxx]

Originally Posted by franalexes

Obama did not once acknowledge our brave men and women who fight for our country....and that myfriends is THE DIFFERENCE !

LOL, that's our fearless leader for you. And you can bet your cute ass if the mission went bad the word "I" would not appear in the speech.

[smc]

Originally Posted by TracyCoxx

LOL, that's our fearless leader for you. And you can bet your cute ass if the mission went bad the word "I" would not appear in the speech.

How convenient to skip over the posting of the truth so you can spew your worthless bile.

But I think I've figured you out, TracyCoxx. The two pictures below are, in fact, one and the same.

[tslust]

Originally Posted by franalexes

The Difference


President George W. Bush's speech afterthe capture of Saddam Hussein:
"The success of yesterday's mission is a tribute to our men and women now serving in Iraq . The operation was based on the superb work of intelligence analysts who found the dictator's footprints in a vast country. The operation was carried out with skill and precision by a brave fighting force. Our servicemen and women and our coalition allies have faced many dangers in the hunt for members of the fallen regime, and in their effort to bring hope and freedom to the Iraqi people. Their work continues, and so do the risks. Today, on behalf of the nation, I thank the members of our Armed Forces and I congratulate them!"


Obama's speech after the killing of Osama bin Laden:
"And so shortly after taking office, I directed Leon Panetta, the Director of the CIA, to make the killing or capture of bin Laden the top priority of our war against al Qaeda, even as we continued our broader efforts to disrupt, dismantle, and defeat his network. Then, last August, I was briefed on a possible lead to bin Laden. It was far from certain, and it took many months to run this thread to ground. I met repeatedly with my national security team as we developed more information about the possibility that we had located bin Laden hiding within a compound deep inside of Pakistan . And finally, last week, I determined that we had enough intelligence to take action, and I authorized an operation to get Osama bin Laden and bring him to justice. Today, at my direction, the United States launched a targeted operation against that compound in Abbottabad , Pakistan ."



Obama did not once acknowledge our brave men and women who fight for our country....and that myfriends is THE DIFFERENCE !

True! Granted as smc points out, those are just snippets of those speaches. However one can not deny that there is a lot of, at the least, distrust between obama and the military. I have spoken with quite a number of military personnel, including dozens of officers. Almost all of them were extremely concerned and distrustful about having to serve under obama. obama has repeatedly promised to slash the military budget (Now mind you, I believe there is a lot of overspending in the military.) also he has shown blatant disregard to military decessions - for example, he wouldn't give the order for the Navy SEAL snipers to shoot the Somali pirates and it took obama about three months of "study" to approve a fraction of the requested troop increase.

A lot of the rank and file I've spoken to are concerned about the possibility of being ordered to engage in oerations against US civilians (hence NDAA). I have always refered them to the decesion that was passed down from the Nurrenberg Trials, that a soldier does not have to follow an order which is illegal.

[smc]

Originally Posted by tslust

True! Granted as smc points out, those are just snippets of those speaches. However one can not deny that there is a lot of, at the least, distrust between obama and the military. I have spoken with quite a number of military personnel, including dozens of officers. Almost all of them were extremely concerned and distrustful about having to serve under obama. obama has repeatedly promised to slash the military budget (Now mind you, I believe there is a lot of overspending in the military.) also he has shown blatant disregard to military decessions - for example, he wouldn't give the order for the Navy SEAL snipers to shoot the Somali pirates and it took obama about three months of "study" to approve a fraction of the requested troop increase.

A lot of the rank and file I've spoken to are concerned about the possibility of being ordered to engage in oerations against US civilians (hence NDAA). I have always refered them to the decesion that was passed down from the Nurrenberg Trials, that a soldier does not have to follow an order which is illegal.

Hearsay evidence of a "distrustful" military aside, it seems to me that independent of whether it is Obama or someone else, having a president who does not routinely say or imply (as Bush did, and as Romney does) that he will simply go along with whatever the "commanders on the ground" advise is not only what the Founding Fathers intended by having a civilian-led military, but a good system of checks and balances. I state that without taking a particular side on shooting Somali pirates or increasing troop sizes, which are certainly questions about which thoughtful consideration could certainly be given.

As for operations against U.S. civilians and the NDAA, I think it's safe to say that Obama is simply continuing George W. Bush's terrible policies. For instance, the the Obama administration argues that the 2001 Authorization for Use of Military Force (AUMF) resolution permits the detentions of United States citizens. Bush and Obama applied AUMF to authorize their use of indefinite detentions around the world. The difference today? NDAA codifies this into law.