Barack Obama

[transjen]

So only the rich should be taken care of and screw the poor guy who maybe is stuck between jobs and no longer has any health ins just let him suffer with a broken arm or how about those who are stuck at a low paying job who can't afford to buy there own so i guess it to bad for them just let them die after all it's there own fault they are not rich and only the rich deserve top health care
Jerseygirl Jen

[The Conquistador]

Originally Posted by transjen

So only the rich should be taken care of and screw the poor guy who maybe is stuck between jobs and no longer has any health ins just let him suffer with a broken arm or how about those who are stuck at a low paying job who can't afford to buy there own so i guess it to bad for them just let them die after all it's there own fault they are not rich and only the rich deserve top health care
Jerseygirl Jen

It is obvious you did not read the link nor took the time to read my actual statements as you have just tried to counter an arguement with emotions.

[randolph]

Wall Street's Naked Swindle
A scheme to flood the market with counterfeit stocks helped kill Bear Stearns and Lehman Brothers - and the feds have yet to bust the culprits

MATT TAIBBI

Posted Oct 14, 2009 9:30 AM

These are the last three paragraphs of a extremely important article in Rollingstones. Very scary!

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics..._swindle/print

The counterfeit nature of our economy is troubling enough, given that financial power is concentrated in the hands of a few key players - "300 white guys in Manhattan," as a former high-placed executive puts it. But over the course of the past year, that group of insiders has also proved itself brilliantly capable of enlisting the power of the state to help along the process of concentrating economic might - making it less and less likely that the financial markets will ever be policed, since the state is increasingly the captive of these interests.

The new president for whom we all had such high hopes went and hired Michael Froman, a Citigroup executive who accepted a $2.2 million bonus after he joined the White House, to serve on his economic transition team - at the same time the government was giving Citigroup a massive bailout. Then, after promising to curb the influence of lobbyists, Obama hired a former Goldman Sachs lobbyist, Mark Patterson, as chief of staff at the Treasury. He hired another Goldmanite, Gary Gensler, to police the commodities markets. He handed control of the Treasury and Federal Reserve over to Geithner and Bernanke, a pair of stooges who spent their whole careers being bellhops for New York bankers. And on the first anniversary of the collapse of Lehman Brothers, when he finally came to Wall Street to promote "serious financial reform," his plan proved to be so completely absent of balls that the share prices of the major banks soared at the news.

The nation's largest financial players are able to write the rules for own their businesses and brazenly steal billions under the noses of regulators, and nothing is done about it. A thing so fundamental to civilized society as the integrity of a stock, or a mortgage note, or even a U.S. Treasury bond, can no longer be protected, not even in a crisis, and a crime as vulgar and conspicuous as counterfeiting can take place on a systematic level for years without being stopped, even after it begins to affect the modern-day equivalents of the Rockefellers and the Carnegies. What 10 years ago was a cheap stock-fraud scheme for second-rate grifters in Brooklyn has become a major profit center for Wall Street. Our burglar class now rules the national economy. And no one is trying to stop them.

[ila]

This post is for those that want to debate the healthcare issue in the U.S.

I think that you should start a new thread to deal with just the proposed government healthcare. This is a debate with the potential to generate many comments and should not be confined to the Obama thread as this involves more than just Obama. If you would like, I can move all healthcare posts into the new thread should one be started.

[transjen]

Originally Posted by TheAngryPostman

It is obvious you did not read the link nor took the time to read my actual statements as you have just tried to counter an arguement with emotions.

I did read your post and i was responding to the first point you pointed out while i agree that it is your own responisibilty to take care of yourself but you don't seem to consider the mishaps of everyday life you can eat all the rite foods exercise everyday and still fall off a bike or go skiing and break a bone from the points you made it sounds like if you don't have your own health ins or a large bank account then it's to bad for you just suffer and die quickly, As for just walk in to an ER and get free care well guess what you get the bill by being charged a lot more since you have health ins so in fact you are paying for the unhealthy all ready so why not just pony up and give everyone decent healthcare which will help small bussness since they will no longer need to provide healthcare benfits and the GOP should love this it would end medicare and medicade as both will no longer be needed universel healthcare is what we need and end our backwards for profit healthcare system


Jerseygirl Jen

[The Conquistador]

Originally Posted by transjen

I did read your post and i was responding to the first point you pointed out while i agree that it is your own responisibilty to take care of yourself but you don't seem to consider the mishaps of everyday life you can eat all the rite foods exercise everyday and still fall off a bike or go skiing and break a bone from the points you made it sounds like if you don't have your own health ins or a large bank account then it's to bad for you just suffer and die quickly, As for just walk in to an ER and get free care well guess what you get the bill by being charged a lot more since you have health ins so in fact you are paying for the unhealthy all ready so why not just pony up and give everyone decent healthcare which will help small bussness since they will no longer need to provide healthcare benfits and the GOP should love this it would end medicare and medicade as both will no longer be needed universel healthcare is what we need and end our backwards for profit healthcare system


Jerseygirl Jen

In an idealistic world that would work. Unfortunately we live in the real world where things like that don't happen. Look at all the countries that have adopted Gov. run this and Gov. run that. Even though there is "economic equality" or some other BS, the quality of products is quite shitty and everyone is made equally poorer than if they had not had Gov. involvement. Universal healthcare is another scam by the powers in charge to make people dependent on the "man" for their needs. Look at how bogus welfare, Social Security and numerous other programs are and do you honestly expect Gov. controlled healthcare to be any less of a clusterfuck just because Obama "says so?"

Besides, how often do you expect to use your healthcare? Yes some things are out of our hands, but the odds of something detrimental happening to you are enormously small. Unless you get hit by a flaming gas tanker or something or happen to be accident prone, you are not going to rack up a giant debt.

Healthcare is not an entitlement. It is earned just like everything else we have. It is part of the meritocracy that helped to make America. Saying that everyone derves this or that is rather naive. Being compassionate to the point where you let it blind you to certain truths like the fact that life is cold is a losing strategy.

If you can afford a plasma screen TV, an Escalade with spinners and a hot rod or rice rocket but are to lazy to shell out extra bucks for your health, you deserve to get hit by a car. Life is full of trade offs; your health should be priority and everything else is just a bonus.

[transjen]

Then why is the average life span in England,French, Germany, Sweden longer then ours and healthcare is no where near as expensive? And what about the guy who has no plasma tv or sports car who barely gets by? A guy who works 40 hrs a week but his company pay low wages and offers no benafits? How in the nine hells can he afford $7000 and up for healthcare insurence? And you forget just a visit to your reg DR is around $100 just for a check up you want a flu shot that's another 50 buck added to the bill and God help you if he needs lab work done on you hope you have an extra grand sitting around
Jerseygirl Jen

[The Conquistador]

Originally Posted by transjen

Then why is the average life span in England,French, Germany, Sweden longer then ours and healthcare is no where near as expensive? And what about the guy who has no plasma tv or sports car who barely gets by? A guy who works 40 hrs a week but his company pay low wages and offers no benafits? How in the nine hells can he afford $7000 and up for healthcare insurence? And you forget just a visit to your reg DR is around $100 just for a check up you want a flu shot that's another 50 buck added to the bill and God help you if he needs lab work done on you hope you have an extra grand sitting around
Jerseygirl Jen

For the first part:

Who cares about Europe? You forget that alot of them come over here for surgeries just like our Canadian neighbors are. If it was so great, people would be going to Europe, not coming here. Show me links about their longevity and other such stuff for me to actually care about them.

For the second part:

How often would said person be going to the doctors for a check up? How much money could be saved between check ups if people were responsible and not blowing thier money on stupid shit?

[The Conquistador]

Here's one for you Jen. You constantly talk about "Big Business" and "lining their pockets" and "the rich getting richer".

Take a gander at this: http://captaincapitalism.blogspot.co...y-profits.html

Originally Posted by Captain Capitalism

Tuesday, October 20, 2009
Insurance Industry Profits

It is claimed by the Obama administration as well as leftists who like to make You Tube videos that the reason health care costs are so high is because of the profits the insurance industry makes. And that if we were to just get rid of those profits then the savings could be passed onto everyday people like you and me.

I was excited about this prospect of paying lower health insurance and so to see how much in savings would be passed onto me I looked up Aetna, one of the larger publicly traded insurance companies out there. I did this on Reuters because Reuters will not only show you the profit margins for the company you are looking at, but the entire industry. That way you can see just how high of profit margins these companies have and how much you're going to save!!!

*See Profitability Ratios picture below*

Originally Posted by Captain Capitalism

Wow! The past 12 months the insurance industry has had a profit margin of .94%. That's not 94% for those of you who majored in liberal arts and never took calculus, that's .94%, LESS THAN 1%.
Now I'll be kind and intellectually honest enough to admit the 5 year average has been 4% in the industry, but are you freaking kidding me? At maximum a savings of 4%?

And let us not kid ourselves kiddies, with the amazing efficiency of the government managing a health insurance plan, you damn well know it's going to gobble up more than that paltry 4% LIKELY COSTING YOU MORE THAN A PRIVATE HEALTH INSURER WOULD.

Oh, but it's not really about the cost, is it? It's the fact somebody else will be paying for it. And that's what this is all about. I just wish people would be intellectually honest about this.

Now compare ins. company profits with their archnemesis COCA-COLA!
http://finapps.forbes.com/finapps/js...ios.jsp?tkr=KO

It would seem that Coca-Cola is "lining their pockets" with alot more money than the Ins. companies, seeing as how sugary drinks scored a 26.3%. Alot higher than medical...

Somehow I feel that you are going to completely disregard this though...

[transjen]

Well i went to Thailand for a major sugery this past Jan as the same sugery here is over double the cost and i won't have received better care or even a better outcome i just would have paid a hell of a lot more and fyi i saved a long time to pay for it
So you think everything is just fine and dandy as it is the poor should save there money and gladly fork it over to greedy DR's or just curl up and die, Oh you got cancer and are one of the working poor well sucks to be you so just curl up and die because only the rich deserve healthcare
Jerseygirl Jen