If police question/detain a black person is it racism?

[TracyCoxx]

If a neighbor sees a couple of guys attempting to break a door in to enter a house and calls the police to report a possible burglary, is the officer who responds to the call and enters the home to investigate and question the people who were observed to be breaking into the house a racist?

If the officer is white, and the suspects are white, no.
If the officer is black, and the suspects are white, no.
If the officer is black, and the suspects are black, no.
If the officer is white, and the suspects are black, yes.

Of course, I'm talking about what's been all over the news the last couple of days. Officer Crowley investigated a reported break-in at a home, he found Henry Gates inside the house. Crowley asked him for his ID. At first Gates refused, then showed the officer some identification. The whole time, Gates was shouting that Crowley is a racist.

Why is the officer a racist?

Now what happened after that wasn't racism. It's just cops suffering the delusion that everyone must fall in line and kiss their ass all the time. Crowley should have just apologized and left. Gates continued to hurl accusations of racism and Crowley insisted that Gates calm down, until eventually he had enough and arrested Gates.

Gates is in his own house. He can say whatever he wants. He has freedom of speech. Police let their egos take over no matter what the race of the people they are interacting with are. I am white and I have seen it many times and I'm tired of it. Their authority only goes so far and they need to know where those boundaries are. But rather than discussing that part of the case, there's a black person involved so we need to go down the racist road yet again.

[jdawg]

If this was a white man trying to get into his house I guarantee that no cops would've been called. SO YES, the caller probably thought that since a black man was in a rich white neighborhood he must've been breaking in. The caller was a racist without even realizing it.




Gates was unruly, there's no doubt, but he should've never been arrested. However, I don't see the racism there and just see a cop being a pig and having his ego hurt by Gates.

[TracyCoxx]

Originally Posted by jdawg

If this was a white man trying to get into his house I guarantee that no cops would've been called. SO YES, the caller probably thought that since a black man was in a rich white neighborhood he must've been breaking in. The caller was a racist without even realizing it.

You're assuming that all rich and white neighbors would not call police if they see a white person breaking into a house? You can determine human traits and capacities based solely on the fact that they are rich and white?

That would make you a...

Originally Posted by Webster

Racist
a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities.

I can google and find several instances of neighbors calling the police on white burglars.

[jdawg]

I'm saying that a black man is more likely to get the cops called on him. The rich white comment is more for dramatic effect. Now if you want to deny that a black man isn't more likely to have this shit happen to him, then boy do I have a mansion to sell you.

[tslust]

In simple terms; yes, but it should not be that way. First of all you've got all the paranoids who jump all over cops and vilify them at any chance they get. (Warning: some people might be offended by this comment.) Also, there is an unspoken guilt, over slavery, being forced on the country. Some people have a chip on their sholder and think that society in general owes them a debt. I say that everyone should be judged by what they do, not what their ancestors have done.

If the black professor should've taken into account that the cop doesn't automaticly know who's a good guy and who's a criminal. When the cop asked for ID, he should've simply shown him his ID. That way, the cop could see that the professor indeed belonged there, and that would be solved.

[TracyCoxx]

Originally Posted by jdawg

I'm saying that a black man is more likely to get the cops called on him. The rich white comment is more for dramatic effect. Now if you want to deny that a black man isn't more likely to have this shit happen to him, then boy do I have a mansion to sell you.

If I see an albino that I don't recognize on my street with a crowbar breaking into a house, I'm calling the cops. I can't see how color has anything to do with what looks like a neighbor's house being broken in to.

The question though, is about Gates' racial accusations of Crowley. Was he justified in calling Crowley a racist for entering his house and asking for ID? Or is he a black man with a chip on his shoulder who tries to make everything about race?

[jdawg]

I gave you the answer to your question. Most of these issues are because of cops being their usual pig self and not really racial at all.



Maybe YOU are color blind, but alot of people in affluent neighborhoods are not. white or black or whatever. The guy walked with a cane and lives in the damn neighborhood. The stupid chick who called the cops should've known it was her neighbor for the simple fact that she's obviously a nosey fucker and should've seen him a few times at some point. I DON't think this was a blatant racist act by any means, but there is a racist component to that phone call.

[TheCrystalKing]

This story calls to mind the Chappelle Show skit where the policeman arrives at a black man's home in response to a 911 call over a breaking-and-entering. The policeman immediately assumes the black homeowner, not the white robber, is the culprit; when his assisstant points out the fact that there are pictures of the 'suspect' and his family all over the wall. The policeman thinks himself all the wiser when he says something to the effect of "oldest trick in the book. This guy came in here, hung up pictures of his family on the wall, then robbed 'em blind"

On this subject, however, a very conservative and Republican friend of mine - whose father happens to be a police officer - had something interesting to say: allegedly, in our county, there were statistically more crimes perpetrated by black males than any other demographic, by a considerable margin. Therefore, my friend argued that his father wasn't being racist in taking the occassional conclusional jump against a potential criminal based on race - he was just listening to the statistics.

I don't know how much I buy into that (since it seems like it's still a decision based on race, even if there are 'facts' to back it up...), but I think it's a tough issue. In this case, just based on my limited knowledge of the scenario, I'd agree with jdawg. There may - but also may not - have been racism involved in the officer's scuffle with Mr. Gates, but there almost certainly was racism in the neighbor's decision to call the police in the first place.

[ and really, had she not seen her neighbor even once? ]

[TracyCoxx]

Originally Posted by TheCrystalKing

On this subject, however, a very conservative and Republican friend of mine - whose father happens to be a police officer - had something interesting to say: allegedly, in our county, there were statistically more crimes perpetrated by black males than any other demographic, by a considerable margin. Therefore, my friend argued that his father wasn't being racist in taking the occassional conclusional jump against a potential criminal based on race - he was just listening to the statistics.

Those statistics are probably true, but I still don't think cops should assume a suspect is probably guilty just because he's black. At the same time, since those statistics say more black males commit crimes than any other demographic, they should not balk if they are caught doing something, or if a police questions them due to reasonable circumstances - like investigating a break-in. The fault is not with the officer who observes blacks committing more than their fair share of crimes as long as he's not using race alone to determine who's a suspect.

[The Conquistador]

Gates is a dumbass. He sounds like one of those schmucks from COPS who gets pulled over for speeding or something minor and then escalates the situation by being loud, uncooperative and obnoxious and then ends up getting a taser shoved in their ass. You can get arrested for verbal abuse and it sounds like that is what happened.

[TracyCoxx]

Chris Rock - How Not to get your Ass Kicked by the Police

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTBskrO9nV8

[lbfno]

[QUOTE=TracyCoxx;96117]Chris Rock - How Not to get your Ass Kicked by the Police


awesome

[violet lightning]

Once again, it all boils down to Common Sense, Rationality and the Golden Rule.
Cops can be abusive at times, I've been the victim and have seen what assholes some cops can be. (in my case, it was mistaken identity which was remedied, but not before being verbally accused and taken downtown in cuffs!) But some of those cops were OK too, so it again boils down to the individual. (not groups like "pigs", thats just as bad!)

So some police can be rascist just as in any job, and guess what some white people are rascist too, and you know what? Some black people are rascist as well!
Its a human trait to be found in all variations of man.
So using common sense, it does seem reasonable (a key word) that a home owner would show his ID to a policeman who was investigating a break-in at his own home. In effect, trying to protect Gates.

Gates was probably already pissed-off about getting locked-out and having to break in to his own home.
As for the person who called in the break-in, I don't know the full details. How much did the person see? The whole break in, or just someones ass sticking out a window and disappearing?
There may be a racial component to the call, but maybe not. If I saw someone breaking into a neighbors house, I honestly wouldn't care about what color they were, or age, or whatever. And I wouldn't go over to ask them what they were doing either. I'd call it in and let the cops deal with it.
(and by the way, that has got to be a reall hard job)

So we have all heard of the real cases of police abuse and I hate it-but I don't hate the police. I certainly don't bow down to them either, but I do try to show respect and cooperate if its warranted. (I think people have a love/hate relationship with police...they can infringe on our personal freedom at times, but boy when we need them, are we glad they are there!)

I feel like in this case , Gates over-reacted and felt singled-out and perhaps embarrassed. (as in "Don't you know who I am... ? )
It sounds like the cop took an earful for as long as he could, and was even outside leaving, as Gates continued to hurl insults at his mother. Now who is verbally abusing who? So the cop could have let it go, but he decided he had had enough and the professor had lots of chances to just let it go.
I think unwittingly, by saying he was a friend of the President, he has actually hurt his friends carreer by creating a mini-uproar.
Now he's being called to the White House for a meeting with Obama. I'd like to be a fly on the wall for that discussion.

What erks me is President Obama and the stupid Governor weighing in on the case before, as they even admitted , all the facts were in. Both assumed the police were wrong and both now sound like Mike Naiphong (sp?) the dumb ass prosecutor in the Duke University "rape" case.
Really dumb, rookie mistakes. Wait till the facts come in, especially in a case involving race issues. (which I wish were "non-issues")

Now racial profiling and statistics are an interesting topic too....

[TracyCoxx]

Originally Posted by violet lightning

What erks me is President Obama and the stupid Governor weighing in on the case before, as they even admitted , all the facts were in.

Yeah, while I agree that Crowley shouldn't have arrested Gates, I do love watching BO squirm. And it's all due to his own inexperience.

[jdawg]

It should be noted that Gates did provide a Harvard ID. So for all of the people saying that he was an asshole who wouldn't provide identification. You're wrong.



I forgot that the chick wasn't a neighbor, but somebody who worked for Harvard. However, I still stand by my earlier comments as Gates is one of the most respected people at Harvard and the driver actually carried Gates' luggage inside the house. She should've known that he lived there for those 2 reasons alone.