Quote:
Originally Posted by ocinteeni
The court cases that is being talked about is that civil rights groups are filing lawsuits to overturn the proposition with the argument that amending the constitution this way goes against the equal protection clause of the constitution. Which these groups are claiming is more than an amendment but a total revision of the interpretation of the constitution.
I live in a really conservative part of Orange County California and it was just absolutely depressing to see the hysteria over Yes on 8 over here. There were frequent rallies at major intersections with almost all Yes on 8 and there was an endless supply of there stupid yellow and blue signs, some making arrogant claims such as "Yes on 8 = Free Speech." Everyday reminding me that people out there are ready to hate you for any difference you might have.
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And yes, this is the OTHER part of what I meant by "messy court battles." Those who supported same-sex marriage...who are FURIOUS that Prop 8 passed...now view this as an outright battle to the death. They see this as the true Civil Rights battle of the 21st century. So, regardless of state court rulings or popular votes or whatever, they want to find some way...any way...to get this heard before the Supreme Court (in Washington). Their view: this all boils down to basic human rights. It all comes down to the right for every person to have a wedding ceremony and marry the person you love, regardless of your sexual orientation.
Except that's where it gets even more tangle now. And sorry about babbling on here, but since this is a global forum, this explanation is for those who live outside the United States...
Basically, the Gay community is still screwed because most people think America is a democracy. But it's not. And even most Americans believe that you can take any case all the way up to the Supreme Court to have your day in court, to get your case heard. But you can't. The truth is America is NOT a democracy. Legally, the United States is a REPUBLIC. And what that means is each and every state...all 50 of them...actually have legal rights to self-determination that
supersedes Federal law out of Washington, DC. And in this case, the Supreme Court (in Washington) actually does NOT have the authority to override the will and the vote of the California people for passing Prop 8. The Supreme Court can NOT overrule Californians for choosing to amend their own State Constitution.
As for what ocinteeni described about her own area (Orange County) that's the other weird thing that's going on in California now. It's amazing to see all these different pocket areas where people have suddenly popped up and said: "Sorry, I can't go along with this. I think I'm a nice person. I don't think I'm a bigot. But I just can't accept same-sex marriage. I don't see it as a civil rights issue. Marriage as a RELIGIOUS concept and government has no right to legislate religion."
And that's where support for same-sex marriage (even in a state as Liberal as California) starts to crumble. As I noted before, the thing that shocked the Gay community on Election Day was that 70-75% of the African-American community...as well as a majority of the Latino/Hispanic community...both of whom turned out in HUGE numbers to support Obama...turned right around and voted FOR Prop 8. And in all the exit polls, that's just what they said: this wasn't a civil rights issue, it was a religious one. So, in a weird plot twist that no one saw coming, the ONE group that the Gay community thought it could count on the most (namey African-Americans given what they went through historically to achieve equality) is now one of their BIGGEST road blocks. Overwhelmingly Black and Hispanic voters, which are also the two largest growing voting blocks in California, said "no" to same-sex marriage based on their more traditional religious beliefs.
So, now things are getting even MORE heated here, as I said before, as the Gay community starts to target churches for their protest rallies. And that's because the Election Day polls revealed
another interesting thing: basically, people believe that even IF same-sex marriage was allowed, a church should still have the right to
turn down a same-sex couple's request to be married there. In other words, people overwhelmingly feel that a church's congregation should still get the final say on "what" happens at their own church. They should still get to say: "Fine, you can get married. But WE get to decide whether or not you do it in OUR church."
And that's a whole other wacky thing that's going on. I actually have neighbors and friends that are gay who -- yes, believe it or not -- voted
for Prop 8. Why? Because aside from being Gay, they're also deeply religious and that was ultimately their final view, too. Namely, they felt that Gay activists should NOT be able to dictate to their churches what ceremonies should be held on their church's property. In the end, they voted to protect their churches and voted against their fellow gays.
So now, the whole thing is just one giant mess. Everyone is arguing from a different perspective and Prop 8 which was designed to simplify things ("Marriage is a man and a woman. Boom! We're done! Next topic!") has only created all sorts of new emotional rifts and even pitted people who
thought they would be allies against each another. So, like I said before, this is going to become a giant series of court battles now, with lots of yelling and screaming, I'm sure...