Originally Posted by Bionca

This is a little disheartening, particularly on a site devoted to men who "admire" women like me. Firstly, I am a "real woman" - gender and biological sex are not the same. Secondly, the reason so often cited for not having an actual relationship with a Tgal has been in essence fear of what others might say. Relegating me to a curiosity or fetish, no consideration of my (our) feelings or needs.

Although I pass all day every day (even without makeup), I am 100% honest about my surgical status when the issue arises. To expect me to lie about a huge chunk of my life isn't exactly fair - imagine going through life never mentioning anything that happened in your first 20 years.

My transition, and those of my friends have shown courage, tenacity, character, strength and compassion that I rarely see in other communities of people. I'd like to be loved and admired for those qualities rather than whats going on in my crotch.

Originally Posted by Bionca

I can't answer for most trans women, but from my observation guys have an uphill battle when it comes to trans women.

It's a combination of some messed up self-image issues with TGs (I think lots of trans women overlook really good guys because they aren't HAWT or whatever). Almost like having a stud validates them as attractive women. On the other hand, getting stood up 10 times in a row buy guys who couldn't wait to actually get a chance with a "girl like you" doesn't make one receptive to #11.

Online dating sites devoted to trans women will absolutely make for some pretty jaded gals. Been there - even I got some messages in my first month. I narrowed the suitors down and met with a few. The results of those meetings has been an almost complete shift in how I handle men. Frankly, I don't much trust them (when I used to give gals hell for not giving guys chances). Once again, it an issue of being dogged out by 100 guys doesn't predispose you well to #101.

My advice is to try to engage trans women as people with interests and hobbies. Find out a gals likes and dislikes from her site profile and open up with that. "I hear you like <thing>, so do I. Have you ever heard of <related thing>?" will get you farther with most gals than "yer cute" (in my case, I was pretty over empty compliments and single sentence contact from guys quickly). Tell her WHY you think the two of you would be a good match. Let her know something about you.

It isn't hard exactly. You just have to assume that she's been contacted by some pretty shady characters using any and every angle to get her. You need to assume that if she decided to end the contact, those same guys used what they knew would be most insulting to get a last "dig" at her. dating while trans is a minefield, and you don't get through it without being burned.

I feel for the genuine guys who seriously want to date trans women. The cruddy part is, those were the guys I THOUGHT I was dating - they all said similar stuff. It becomes very hard to sort through the REAL guys who really want to date a trans woman, and the guys who know that they need to pretend to be REAL men who want to date trans women to get any play at all.